MG34 Transit box contents

[bergflak]

Sorry there buddy, just pulling your leg

No, the Germans never had any transit boxes for the MG34 (or MG42) that we know of. The ones in circulation are all made for the Portuguese army's contract bought MG34's. And every little detail of these tell us that these are in fact not manufactured in Germany at all. The Norwegian army also had them (made in Norway) for storage in depots, but that is quite another story....

[panzerwest]

So from what I'm reading the German mg34's and 42's never came in a case of any kind? They must have come in some kind of shipping container from the factories. I can't see them stacked in piles in the backs of trucks being hauled to the unit armories etc

[FKpt.Fritz]

now that you mention it....

and very very large box with them all stacked inside in a rail car is probably more like it.....

[JBaum]

Yes, the Germans did have a transport chest for the MG34... actually for two MG 34 guns.

Here's a picture from the 1936 dated D127/1 German Army issued manual that I sell (shameless plug).

Click on the picture... it'll look better when you see if full size.

[bergflak]

Would classify that as a gun-rack with lid on. !!

[JBaum]

It is a box that holds guns, the guns are carried (transported) in it, and it's on a German wagon in a German manual.

It is therefore a German transit box.
.
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There is a thing called a "Duck test" that applies to this.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a duck.

Calling the bird a chicken does not make it a chicken. It is incorrect, and it annoys the duck.

[bergflak]

Oh, splitting of words can be sooo fun!
You might define it as a "transport" box, but it ain't a "transit" box! Calling it a "transit box" just isn't accurate, as long as the "box" is a part of the wagon, and is bolted to it. I do have the original manual myself and I can also see that it is a box specially made to fit two MG34's, but it is nonetheless not a box of the type we discuss here!

The duck test can be quite funny if you apply it any way you want of course! Let me try this one:

A Tiger Tank is a box on tracks, it has racks for MP40's inside, the guns are carried in racks inside the tank, ergo the Tiger is a MP40 transit box!

The transit box we are discussing here is not a bolted on part of a wagon but a "movable" box for transport (from transport means to transport means) or storage. Thank you for sharing the photo, but it just isn't the box we are discussing here!

[glassmountains]

vt [trans páwrt] (past trans·port·ed, past participle trans·port·ed, present participle trans·port·ing, 3rd person present singular trans·ports)
1. transport carry somebody or something: to carry people or goods from one place to another, usually in a vehicle
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

tran·sit [tránzit]
n (plural tran·sits)
1. act of travel across something: the act of traveling or being transported through or across an area, over a distance, or from one place to another
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

Whatever you call it, it's still a box that was designed to hold the gun and that seems to be the real issue.

[bergflak]

vt [trans páwrt] (past trans·port·ed, past participle trans·port·ed, present participle trans·port·ing, 3rd person present singular trans·ports)
1. transport carry somebody or something: to carry people or goods from one place to another, usually in a vehicle
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

tran·sit [tránzit]
n (plural tran·sits)
1. act of travel across something: the act of traveling or being transported through or across an area, over a distance, or from one place to another
Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2004 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

Whatever you call it, it's still a box that was designed to hold the gun and that seems to be the real issue.

No, you are off by a mile here. Yes, indeed it is a box designed to hold two guns, but that is far from the issue in this thread (try to read it from the start!). The issue here is "Did the Germans have a transit box for their MG34 like the ones the Portugese stored and transported their MG34's in!" Many collectors think that the Portuguese boxes are German originals (and are sometimes fooled to part with their money by unhonest sellers telling half-truths!). Confusing other collectors does not help them along, it only helps the unhonest sellers!
The case bolted to a wagon is not a "transit" box or "transport" box like the Portuguese as discussed above. It is simply a gun rack with a lid, and not meant for storage or any other type of transport other than the one the actual wagon travels!! The Germans had of course several means of transportation for their equipment and guns. Another well known example is the Fallschirmjäger parachute cylinder (which was actually box-shaped). Yes, it did transport the MG34's from the airfield to the LZ, but again it is not an equivalent of the Portuguese boxes we are discussing.

[Bil]

I would still like to know how the Germans got the guns from the front gate to the front lines-I find it had to believe they just threw them in a sack and dumped them into trucks.Even some sort of crude packing case would explain it.I have read where they broke up the crates used to transport ammo etc,and used the wood to make duckboards and as lining in bunkers.Even as firewood.If this controversy keeps up,I may have to go to Germany and ask at the veterans reunion! ---bil BTW transit-noun-an optical device used to find a level line,used in the building trades. Bils encyclopedia,2008

[bergflak]

I would still like to know how the Germans got the guns from the front gate to the front lines-I find it had to believe they just threw them in a sack and dumped them into trucks.Even some sort of crude packing case would explain it.I have read where they broke up the crates used to transport ammo etc,and used the wood to make duckboards and as lining in bunkers.Even as firewood.If this controversy keeps up,I may have to go to Germany and ask at the veterans reunion! ---bil BTW transit-noun-an optical device used to find a level line,used in the building trades. Bils encyclopedia,2008

I seem to remember that "Back bone of the Wehrmacht" had something on the transportation of guns from the factory to the units. Strictly not on topic in this thread. I think it would have been "much ado about nothing", building a box like the Portuguese ones for the trip from the factory to the front line units. Putting several guns in bigger makeshift crates, using loading equipment for trains and trucks is more likely! And crates like this would probably not be returned to the factory....

[glassmountains]

I don't believe the Germans had any type of crate/box, whatever, to transport their guns. They were issued to the troops and they carried them. Think about the BAR and 1917/1919 Browning. They did not have any official transport box. The British had a storage box for the Bren but you do not see any photos of them in action on the front line. Only for storing them @ the Depot. Why would you want to lug around a 20 + pound box as well as a 25 pound gun? I believe all were issued with some type of canvas cover to protect the entire gun or at least the action.

[Bil]

What I was refering to was the box or crate used before they were issued to the troops-a separate item than the 'transit box' in question.I am sure that each gunner did not go to the factory,there must have been some was of getting these to the front or the regional armories.Perhaps in crates containing many guns at a time.I agree that hauling a box around would be foolish,that is akin to me saving the original box my TV came in ,in the event I needed to send it back-although the manual does specify 'original packaging'! ---bil

[panzerwest]

Maybe I called the transit case the wrong term. When an mg34 was issued it came with certain items correct? How many spare barrels came with the gun and did their serial numbers match the gun's numbers. I'm sure when a gun left the factory with it's accessories it came in some kind of box or case would it not?

[Bil]

Have you ever inadvertantly stepped on a bees nest? And not realised it until the bees were all around? If not,you just did! This is a continuing source of controversy on this and other sites.What you say makes sense,but just do a search and you will see what I mean.As for now,I would say definately maybe! ---bil

[bergflak]

Maybe I called the transit case the wrong term. When an mg34 was issued it came with certain items correct? How many spare barrels came with the gun and did their serial numbers match the gun's numbers. I'm sure when a gun left the factory with it's accessories it came in some kind of box or case would it not?

I am afraid that we do not know this for certain! People use the Portuguese contract MG34's as a "check list". They are 1943 made, and the accessories are well documented, as they were stored in (Portuguese made ) transit cases with the accessories. But if the Porto contract had the same number of barrels etc as the WH ordered guns is at best unsure! Most likely there will be differences. The Poruguese guns probably only saw test firing, while WH guns wandered across Europe and back. How many barrels, and what equipment that followed each gun has also probably differed greatly during the course of war! And forget about keeping numbered barrels to each gun! After a few weeks of trench war on the Eastern front they would have needed extra barrels en-masse!

[Tim g]

I don't believe the Germans had any type of crate/box, whatever, to transport their guns. They were issued to the troops and they carried them. Think about the BAR and 1917/1919 Browning. They did not have any official transport box. The British had a storage box for the Bren but you do not see any photos of them in action on the front line. Only for storing them @ the Depot. Why would you want to lug around a 20 + pound box as well as a 25 pound gun? I believe all were issued with some type of canvas cover to protect the entire gun or at least the action.

Hi glassmountain, interesting comment on the bren, not commonly seen and you are correct in saying most likley chucked
.........but.....i have seen photo,s of troops in extremis ie retreating thro crete and they are still lugging that bloody stupid 20 pound box.
As for bergflack and the transit vs storage box i agree. The mouser factory did indeed have transit boxes for K98,if i remember rightly it was for 12 rifles,stacked alternatly in layers with dividers. Quite rough to look at with a large chicken burnt to the side of the case. We know to our cost that it is entirly possible to bust a cocking handle on the 34 .......why on earth would the plant risk damaging valuable weapons delivering them to the depots. It could be possible that the transport was fitted with racks to protect the cargo. ( the sten was deliverd in a three ton truck and had racks for something like 500 weapons,
photo in P Laidlers book)
Once deliverd to the depot......would the company care after that?......probably not. I would suggest that if they were used they would not hold many , no fork lifts in the 40,s muscle only.