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Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

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Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Sat Mar 18, 2017 2:34 pm

Just want to be informed on pricing of semi mg42/m53 now in 2017. It looks like the only retailer WLA has two in stock for $5200 plus shipping. Rest are used ones sold all over different forums and auctions with different pricing.
It looks like 'hack job' S.A M53 is going for about $3000 and quality build german ww2 S.A MG42 is going for $6000 and the rest fall in between. Are my findings right?

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby blackreichswehr » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:49 am

what do you mean by "hack job" ?

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:58 pm

blackreichswehr wrote:what do you mean by "hack job" ?


Welded up receiver where weld beads are still visible, welded up rails

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Mon Mar 27, 2017 5:34 pm

This forum is dead :?

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby Sw1ngK1ng » Mon Mar 27, 2017 5:58 pm

What do you think a quality home built mg53 with a nice finish would go for with no extras?

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Tue Mar 28, 2017 1:33 am

Sw1ngK1ng wrote:What do you think a quality home built mg53 with a nice finish would go for with no extras?


$800

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:03 pm

hakentt wrote:
Sw1ngK1ng wrote:What do you think a quality home built mg53 with a nice finish would go for with no extras?


$800


Well, that's the hakentt that we all remember.

$3,000 would be closer to reality.
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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby Sw1ngK1ng » Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:30 pm

jbaum wrote:$3,000 would be closer to reality.


Still wish that number was higher too lol. They take so much time to build.

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:03 pm

I don't do the semi 42s, so it may well be worth more. Gunbroker would be a good place to watch to see what the latest selling prices are. For a full auto, it's around $40,000.
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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby Sw1ngK1ng » Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:35 am

jbaum wrote:I don't do the semi 42s, so it may well be worth more. Gunbroker would be a good place to watch to see what the latest selling prices are. For a full auto, it's around $40,000.


I see a lot of guns sell for far higher than their real value on there so if I ever do sell that will probably be where. One day I hope to have a full auto but they may be completely banned by time that day comes.

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Wed Mar 29, 2017 11:57 pm

jbaum wrote:I don't do the semi 42s, so it may well be worth more.


Full auto MG42 is not fun, I see few guys on the gun range always get frustrated, it never runs smooth, it will rip 10 rounds then stop, then do 20 then stop, then do 5 then stop, by the end of the day they wasted 1000 rounds and were dirty as mechanics clearing all the fail to cycle, fail to eject, fail to fire problems. This all may be do to inconsistent Romanian surplus ammo. They were changing all the parts back and forth and still same problem. And it is not the only FA MG that I have see with same problem.

Semi auto MG42 is more fun, at least mine never stops with newer production FMJ ammo, I assume it is more reliable because there is more time between each round, harmonics smooth out.

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:43 am

They're fun when they run right.

I've had my MG42 for 20 years, and have not experienced any problems getting it to run well. I don't run 40 year old junk ammunition in it either, so you may well have spotted the reason for one gun to run poorly (the full auto), and another to run well (the semi). Bad fuel can make any engine run poorly. You're right, good ammo in a semi will run better than bad ammo in a full auto, but that doesn't make the semi auto good and the full auto bad.

It seems odd that you recognize a problem with the ammunition, yet blame the gun because it's full auto. The inability of the owner to get the gun to run right when all they do is swap parts while they still feed it the same junk ammo, is a pretty good indication that it isn't the gun parts causing the problem. It would seem from your statements, that the MG42 owners don't know what they're doing, and I'd have to agree with that. Some that I've met, don't, but it's not somehow the fault of the gun, as the gun isn't the one buying junk ammo. Siphoning gas from cars in a junk yard to put in a classic high performance car is counter-intuitive on many levels, and so is running surplus junk ammunition in a $40,000 gun. You wouldn't do it, neither would I. Some people, on the other hand, would buy a 707 HP Hemi Hellcat, and complain about the cost of gas and try to run it on regular.

The harmonics smooth out? That's precious.
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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:10 am

jbaum wrote:I've had my MG42 for 20 years, and have not experienced any problems getting it to run well. I don't run 40 year old junk ammunition in it either

It seems odd that you recognize a problem with the ammunition, yet blame the gun because it's full auto. The inability of the owner to get the gun to run right when all they do is swap parts while they still feed it the same junk ammo, is a pretty good indication that it isn't the gun parts causing the problem. It would seem from your statements, that the MG42 owners don't know what they're doing, and I'd have to agree with that.


That Romanian ammo in spam cans is pretty consistent and known good ammo. What is the other choice? You got to run military spec FMJ and as far as I know there aren't any imported into US, and the ones that are imported are for hunting. Guys at the range had different weight bolts, spings, different size booster parts. FA needs a sweet spot, you got to be lucky and have it all matched up. Even WLA does this with their Semis, they keep changing parts until it runs right.

I got few questions for you. Yugo military manual does now show anti bounce spring for the bolt. I wonder did M53 all come with this part? What are the sizes of Yugo booster cone assembly? Main spring length? Bolt weight? Talking about FA

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:56 pm

FMJ ammo is not required. The gun doesn't know if the bullet tip is hollow or pointed. If I'm shooting 8mm Mauser, I use reloads since it's cheaper than factory, and I don't trust surplus. The initial quality of manufacture is usually a known thing, but how long and how well it's been stored is a big question. Sealed in a can doesn't mean that the powder hasn't started eating through the steel shells from the inside out. Blowing up a gun because someone is too cheap to use good quality ammo is inexcusable in my view.

The mysterious "sweet spot" isn't a mystery at all for a properly made gun. The guns that are glued together with bad welds, crooked and out of spec, are a lot of trouble. We've all seen some of the disasters that are out there. That applies to anything that's put together by someone who doesn't have the skills, whether it's a gun, motorcycle or car.

There is no proper length for a recoil spring. Spring length is only one of the many specifications. Resistance, diameter, compressed length, total weight needed to compress the spring, wire diameter - they are all required to be near the spec for it to work properly. Buying a modern spring (RTG) and using that is the simplest way to be sure of what you have. The recuperator springs need to function properly too. 70 year old springs aren't likely to work in anything the way they were designed.

What Wiselite does to get a gun to run is due to the problems inherent in the semi auto design. A semi 42 is on the edge for having enough energy to operate to start with, and with a less than perfect assembly, it's an uphill battle to make it run. I have no problem using the same booster for 7.62 and 8mm Mauser. I trade the top cover, feed tray, and barrel, and that's all. Mine runs fine, but I only use quality ammunition, whether that is military surplus 7.62, or reloaded 8mm Mauser or 7.62.

What the M53 was made with from the factory is not something I'd know. The M53 is a direct copy of the 42, so everything except the buttstock and buffer works for either gun. The standard bolt should not be replaced with a heavy or very heavy bolt, since nobody seems to have the heavy or very heavy buffer that it needs to run it properly. The bolt and buffer have to be matched, and the people who switch the bolt without matching it to the correct buffer just beat the gun to death, then blame the gun.

The German manual says the 8mm uses either 14 mm nozzle or the 11.5 mm (for a faster rate of fire). The 11 mm nozzle is only used with shooting 7.62 ammo. I don't read Yugoslav, and don't have any idea what they made in theirs or what their manual says. I've only ever seen heavy and very heavy bolts that were German or Austrian (MG74). The Yugo bolts I've seen were all the standard weight, the same as the German standard bolts.

The lack of knowledge about the MG42 is what caused me to start translating the original manuals 12 years ago. I asked 5 people how my gun worked, and got 5 different answers. That means at least 4 of them had to be wrong. As it turns out, once I explained how the gun worked to a few people, and that I got my information from translating one of the original manuals for the gun, I started selling a lot of manuals. Now that there are a few thousand MG42 manuals out there, and a lot of people who have built semi autos, how the gun works is no longer a mystery. It's certainly a different method of operation than the normal semi auto rifle, but it's easy to understand and make work, perhaps less so when it's a semi, but it's still doable.

Swapping parts is a horrible way to try to make anything work. It demonstrates a lack of knowledge about what is happening, and ignorance about how to fix it. Ignorance is curable through education. Most everything that can go wrong or be wrong with a 42 is discussed somewhere on this board. People just need to read, or at the least, ask questions. I don't require someone to buy a manual for me to give them the answer, they just need to ask. I don't know everything there is to know about a 42, but I've read 10 manuals in two languages on the gun, so I may have a head start on some people.
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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:33 pm

So M53 has 11.5mm booster cone opening and 47mm long barrel bearing? This is what I have. Yugo manual is 264 pages long and is probably written based on german manuals but it does not indicate measurments of the parts, this leads me to believe Yugos only made one size.

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:56 pm

I've never seen anything about barrel bearing length in the manuals, and don't know how closely matched the Yugo version is compared to the German.
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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Thu Mar 30, 2017 5:08 pm

do you have the metric specs of the MG42 receiver? I can't seem to find solid answer. What main spring lengths are out there?

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Thu Mar 30, 2017 5:56 pm

Since the MG3 is still being made, having a valid, factory set of specs for the receiver isn't going to happen. Lots of people have spent time measuring their receivers, and several posts have been on here showing drawings with dimensions. Whether or not they're correct is anyone's guess.

The recoil spring Is supposed to reach from the rear of the receiver to the front edge of the feed tray, according to the manual.
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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby hakentt » Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:15 pm

jbaum wrote:The recoil spring Is supposed to reach from the rear of the receiver to the front edge of the feed tray, according to the manual.


It does not make any sense. Springs measure around 16 to 17 inches and from rear of the receiver to the front feed tray is about 14.5 inches.
Give me exact measurements of your MG42 and your spring, I want to compare those measurements to my Yugo, metric please.

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Re: Pricing of semi MG/M53 now in 2017?

Postby JBaum » Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:25 pm

The recoil spring Is supposed to reach from the rear of the receiver to the front edge of the feed tray, according to the manual. They can be longer, that is the shortest it's supposed to be.
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