Hello from Bavaria

[bmg17a1]

The uncheckered grips show up here and there and in my opinion are replacements or altered n the field by the gunners. Among the twenty or so spare grip frames I have, there are two with one checkered grip and one plain and one with both plain. The plain grips are contoured more heavily in the finger grooves than the checkered grips from what I can see and appear to be made from formerly checkered ones, as they are different.
Also have a lot 1918 DWM 08s, a couple 1917, and single guns sequentially from there down to 1914 and then big jump to 1908 manufctured DWM. All the DWMs have checkered grips. Have a number of Spandaus, 1917, 1916, 1915 etc and all have checkered grips.
It doesn't make any logical sense to me that DWM would send out 08s without checkered grips during the course of any of their production given the uniformity of the guns, with only very minor changes over the years of producction.
If a really nice set of grip wood shows up anywhere Jmann I'll pick them up for you.
That's all I have......

Bob Naess

[jmann]

Thanks for the insight Bob. I was hoping you would chime in as you have more under roof for inspection than anyone. I originally believed they were replacements as well, but I cant understand how they would be on my gun. This gun obviously saw no service before Doug owned it and every part including barrel is matching except for the lower feed arm and lock which are unnumbered. It had the typical broken lower feed arm and the lock is a replacement which tells me it was taken directly from the greasy crate it came to the usa in and was gifted to someone, being demilled in the way almost all of them were back then. If they were replaced it, it was by someone who really was cautious as the slots on the large screws holding the grips on dont appear to have ever had a screwdriver in them. I didnt want to replace them with checkered ones until I knew for sure they were not original to the gun. Sort of like some of the guys who get so caught up in restoring the garands to original they destroy some history in the process.
Obviously a sample size of one will never prove anything and I understand that. Just another instance that could be rectified if these damn things could talk.
Thanks for the info guys.

[bmg17a1]

Just off the top of my head, I would say that you are making a lot of assumptions about the hisotry of that gun. Without some verifiable provanance aobut where it has been since it left the factory, there is just no way of knowing anything about it.
The manufacturing quality of the uncheckered grips is quite average, and the ones on your gun are clearly used and also of average quality. There is just no way that the DWM factory would put substandard grips on a newly fiinished gun, at least it would be very difficult to convince me that would be the case. The original factory grips do not appear to have any finish surface applied to them, such as any kind of shellac or similar finish, and appear to be 'dry', so to speak, maybe stained and dried, etc. The uncheckered ones I have all show evidence of some sort of finish, preservative, polish, or whatever, which suggests to me that they were assembled under some later circumstances. Grips get broken from the gun being stood up on the handles on a hard surface, or from any number of accidents, etc, so a fairly unused gun can still wind up with replacement grips.
That's my best guess about it, anyway.......

Bob

[jmann]

Thanks Bob. Do you think the smooth grips were German replacements ( possibly shellacked so they wouldn't deteriorate in a spare parts chest) or an aftermarket item not German at all or at least not wwi German?

[bmg17a1]

It's anybodie's guess when and where these grips were assembled to the guns, and witout any arsenal, field repair or manual documentation, it will be difficult to know for sure. I've been curious aobut the uncheckered grips but haven't done andy research on them and really do't know where to llok. Always hope someone who is into that kind of inquirty will come up with a reasonable and verfiable explanation.

Bob

[www.Prussia.us]

Bob, did you (or anyone else) see a lot of what IMA dragged out of Turkey back when they had the 08 parts kits, (just wondering what the Turks put on spade grips that were worn, that is wood that look like German issue or their own variation)?

[IMBLITZVT]

I have one of these smooth grips. Its larger than the checkered grips... so not made from one. Turk I think would be a good guess???

[jmann]

I will measure my grips to see what the dimensions are compared to a set of checkered ones. I will take some pics and see how they compare. Hopefully can do it this evening. Over the weekend I noticed Mark's gun in the pic with the field mount bipod appeared to have smooth grips as well, so its not just a USA phenomenon.

[jmann]

I measured the grips and what I found is interesting. While the smooth ones appear to have much more relief to the finger groves than the checkered ones, it is not the case. I measured both grips with calipers and was somewhat suprised by my findings. The checkered grips I was using were from a parts set and are some of the best 08 grips I have run across. The points are uncomfortably sharp so I trust the dimension as at least close to new.
The front to back measurement of the grips was .02 greater on the smooth grips at every measurement. This means every valley and every peak was the same .02" greater on the smooth ones. The width, left to right, where no checkering exists on either grip was identical in measurement on both styles and I took it at five places on both grips. There was obviously great care in duplicating every bump and hump exactly if these were copy's. Or perhaps they were seconds turned on the same machinery not deemed worthy of the time it would take to checker them. Or who knows. I realize I have not brought anything to light other than some measurements, but it does make for interesting conversation.

[bmg17a1]

One of the grips I have I got in the early eighties and others later, and they are not from the Turk guns although there might have been some on the Turk guns acquired by IMA. The wood does not appear to be the typical walnut used on the 08s, so the source of the wood and the maker are not factory in my opinion, which is just speculation. Since some guns had one only, it seems that they are a replacement.

Bob