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My Build, step by step

Ask your build questions here. Welding, assembly, etc.
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TOM R
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Postby TOM R » Tue Sep 06, 2005 10:19 pm

ok karb remember seein it but can't find it now
:?
Great men are born in fire, it is the privilege of lessor men to light the flame, no matter the cost


FOR M60 GOTO http://WWW.M60MG.COM
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Postby Pirate » Thu Sep 08, 2005 6:43 pm

Finally made some progress today. I tried using the 3/16" dia firing pns I made. I didn't use them
because I thought they would be to heavy and they fit kind of tight. After messing around with
this thing, I learned several things.
!. the firing pin needs to be the right length, if it is to long it will bind whan hit by the hammer.
2,. the ejector extension needs to fit properly or it will cause binding, even if it seems loose.
3. the hammer must strike the pin squarely on a flat face.
The pin design I got from some photos was overkill with the bushings, I used a couple of #8 flat
washers on the 3/16" pin. all they need to do is hold the firing pin spring in the front and
support the ejector extension in the rear.
After welding and grinding the hammer face several times I have it popping primers consistantly.
the firing pin nose could protrude a little more so I plan on extending it about another .025 or so.
I also ground the bottom of the bolt more to give additional clearance for the reworked hammer.
I have a grip stick and new hammer coming next week to grind to the proper shape.
I will head out to the range after work tomorrow to do a live fire test. If all goes well I will
post pictures of the mods with dimentions of the parts.. for those of you who want to buy the
conversion parts kit I will start getting prices on getting the various parts machined.

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Postby Pirate » Sat Sep 10, 2005 2:36 pm

my first and easiest solution is to move the fcg back so that the hammer is forward of
vertical. the theory here is that the angle of the hammer will present enough resistance
to the firing pin to keep it in place after hitting the primer. this is based on the breech
locking mechanism of the luger toggle lock where the pivot of the toggle is below center
holding the toggle closed. hopefully this wilth a stronger hammer spring will solve the
problem.
This also puts the trigger closer to the safety, making it easier to modify the safety to work.
I have some heavier hammer springs and new hammers coming to redo this setup, hopefully
it will work and save trying to design a whole new fcg.
Attachments
gsv2.jpg
gsv2.jpg (234.96 KiB) Viewed 4440 times

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Postby Pirate » Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:00 pm

I got in some new ar parts today, replaced the hammer and hammer spring. the new
hammer has more mass and with the new spring works well. it hits the fp with a nice
solid thwack and makes a good dimple in the primer. I am going to try to test it thursday
or friday night. I have some heavy duty hammer springs coming from brownells and hope
to have them by friday.
I have a FAL lower coming, using the FAL fcg looks promising, it should solve the primer
problem with the robust hammer spring and hopefully can incorporate the FAL safety also.
I am going to try to incorporate it without using side plates if possible, and will make some sort
of pin on arrangement for the grip stick to attach in front..

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Postby Pirate » Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:45 pm

The FAL parts came in today, I got a complete lower from Sportsmans guide, the lowers
are listed as vg to excelent condition. NOT!!! however I have everything I need to see if
this will work. At first glance it looks like these parts were made for this conversion.
the FCG fits into the gripstick and the axis pins for the trigger and hammer are closer
than the ar ones. this is a good feature as I am planning on pinning the gripstick in the front
with hk style pins. The hammer spring is VARY heavy and should support the primers
perfectly. The only part that will be a pita is the trigger return spring, it is a spring
plunger arangement in back of the trigger.

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Postby Pirate » Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:53 pm

This is a photo of the FAL fcg, the trigger fits into the gripstick perfectly widthwise I need
to figure the proper location for the placement. the hammer will need some modification
to fit properly with the spring and plunger tube and to clear the retracting stud on the
bolt. the hammer is tall and beefy.
Attachments
falfcg1.jpg
falfcg1.jpg (41.72 KiB) Viewed 4375 times

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Postby Pirate » Tue Sep 20, 2005 6:00 pm

This photo shows the location of the hammer / trigger holes, the fal parts are closer
together than the ar. this is good as it fits more compactly than the ar parts do.
Attachments
falfcg2.jpg
falfcg2.jpg (54.87 KiB) Viewed 4372 times

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Postby Pirate » Thu Sep 22, 2005 6:25 pm

The first step to install the FAL fcg is to remove the front gripstick ears. they are
spot welded in 3 places. locate the welds, centerpunch them and drill them out.
after the ears are removed weld the holes closed. The trigger pin hole will need
to be welded closed also.
Attachments
falfcg3.jpg
falfcg3.jpg (137.06 KiB) Viewed 4342 times

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Postby Pirate » Thu Sep 22, 2005 6:28 pm

In order to get the holes in the proper location I made a template from 1/8" steel to
drill the gripstick. the location of the holes relative to each other is critical for proper
sear engagement.
Attachments
falfcg4.jpg
falfcg4.jpg (172.87 KiB) Viewed 4343 times

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Postby Pirate » Thu Sep 22, 2005 6:46 pm

the FAL lower is a little wider than the mg42 gripstick, also there is a reinforcing plate
on the sides in the rear. This creates a clearance problem with the hammer spring
tube. to correct this about .125" needs to be removed from the left side of the hammer.
this will allow the tube to sit properly. I will also add a plate or washer on the left side
of the hammer to add some thickness to that area of the gripstick, as it is thin in that area.
The pins are grooved for a locking plate, regular "E" clips could also be used to retain
them.
I am also thinking of using the FAL safety. since it is designed to work with the rest of
the parts, I think it will work better than some modification of the mg 42 one.
Two plates need to be made, one to support the hanner spring tube and another for the
trigger spring and plunger. In addition a trigger stop of some sort may be needed, most
likely a small pin
Although this setup is a little more complicated than the AR fcg it has several advantages
over the AR parts. You don't need sideplates, this will allow the use of the origonal
parts for the lower dust cover.
The setup was designed for large rifle primers, it has a powerfull spring and heavy
hammer. This should provide proper, consistant ignition and prevent primer blowout.
Attachments
falfcg5.jpg
falfcg5.jpg (327.11 KiB) Viewed 4339 times

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MauserMatt
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Postby MauserMatt » Thu Sep 22, 2005 10:00 pm

Do you think there will be any modifications to the bolt to use the FAL fcg? I mean if I had the bolt modified by huntsinmtns for the AR parts would there be anything else to have done to get the FAL parts to work? I think with this new concept of the FAL parts being used I'd rather go that route than the AR fcg...

Thanks!
~Matt

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Postby Pirate » Fri Sep 23, 2005 8:05 am

The basic concept is the same. I don't know what hunts mods look like so I can't say for
sure. the only difference will be the width of the hammer and the strenght of the hammer
spring. I think it would be best to use a 3/16" firing pin with this fcg.

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Postby Pirate » Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:05 pm

I have the gun ready to test again. The FAL fcg is installed after a lot of work, however I
think it will be worth it. I also made a 2 peice firing pin to see if it would work, also out
of despiration as I haven't been able to get acess to my friends lathe. The pin is a 3/16"
striker with 2 washers silver brazed on to locate the springs. I am using an original 42
firing pin, tests with primers give a good primer indent. the best yet, much better than the
ar even with the extra heavy ar hammer spring.
I also got a new recoil spring, it is la lot longer than the one that came with the kit, and
seems to work a lot better locking the bolt closed. I would recommend replacing your
spring with a brand new one. A worn out mainspring can lead to big problems.
For the tests I got some south african .308 it was made in the 80's and is berdan primed
non corrosive. I shot about 160 rounds of this stuff in my G3 and it seems like good ammo.
I also got in some 8mm parts from Dan, a bbl, topcover and feed tray, the parts are like new
Thanks Dan!!! I have some romanian 8mm to test also, but want to get the gun working
satisfactorly before trying it.

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Postby Pirate » Tue Oct 04, 2005 7:03 pm

This is the finished bolt with mods, I am using the spoon style ejector extension, the FA
firing pin and a striker rod. The rod is 3/16" drill rod, hardened on the ends with 4 #8
flat washers silver brazed on. the rear washer rests on the feed stud to limit rearward travel.
the front washer retains the fp spring. There are several advantages to using the original fp.
It is dimentionally correct, heat treated, cheap and simple to make spare srtikers.
It has performed well so far and I am happy with it.
The photo of the gripstick has the fal fcg installed. The hammer pin is retained by the receiver
the trigger pin by the grips. I installed a pin to limit trigger travel. It should work properly now.
I will be testing the gun in a day or two.
Attachments
striker2.jpg
striker2.jpg (19.54 KiB) Viewed 4842 times
boltbolt9.jpg
boltbolt9.jpg (27.12 KiB) Viewed 4821 times
falfcg7.jpg
falfcg7.jpg (40.67 KiB) Viewed 4803 times

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Postby Pirate » Sat Oct 15, 2005 6:02 pm

I will be starting 2 new threads on my build. since some of the information for the
bolt and gripstick conversion has changed I will post a seperate thread for each
part with the revised mods. Disreguard the bolt and gripstick information in this thread.

karl wilhelm

Postby karl wilhelm » Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:21 pm

Stupid Question:

In the normal FA setup the ejector pin is activated by rearward motion of the bolt which "hits" the butstock and causes the cart. to eject. What activates the ejector rod in your modified bolt?

Thanks in advance.

smoggle
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Postby smoggle » Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:27 pm

The ejector function remains the same.

karl wilhelm

Postby karl wilhelm » Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:33 pm

Ok, so the "buttstock end" is a smaller dia. than the bolt extention and it fits "inside" to hit the ejector normally.

That was my one last hurdle. I'll be working on it this weekend. It is being made a semi-auto blank only .308 just for reenacting. ill let you know how things work out.

Thanks!

Brass Scrounger

Postby Brass Scrounger » Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:17 pm

Hi Pirate! Terrific job you're doing!

Just a heads up on the FAL FCG - the FAL safety can be used, but it may be desirable to add a stop so it cannot be rotated to the 8 o'clock position. This is the rock'n'roll (full auto) pos and even though the gun will only go bang once while in this position, you will get a hammer follow-though and would require cycling the bolt to recock the hammer - kind of annoying when you're in the heat of the moment.

Cheers!

The FNG

schaubel777
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Postby schaubel777 » Fri Feb 17, 2006 3:48 pm

I've heard enough. Pirate, can I call you to discuss shipping addresse and what to send. I want to get this underway yesterday. I know your backed up. I just want to get the parts to you so I can pressure myself into finishing the rec. mods and to start welding. Thanks for all you have done on this.


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